
Tonight Kjersti and I went and saw Religulous -- Bill Maher's documentary film about religion and how ridiculous it is. I liked it. I thought it was incisive, compelling, and frankly cathartic. Ten years ago -- maybe even five years ago -- I wouldn't have been able to openly admit that I liked this movie. It would have been "social suicide" as one ex-mormon in the movie described it (he was talking about actually leaving the church, which is obviously a much bigger deal, but you know what I mean). I don't claim to be an ex-mormon. I've never been religious. But in a very religious place in a very religious country, to be openly appalled by religion is not really something you can do in front of all your family and friends. Usually it doesn't seem worth it. You'll never change someone's mind. And you have to really ask if you want to be responsible for changing someone's mind.
The movie reminded me of how lonely I've been my whole life. I'm not trying to win sympathy points here, I don't feel bad for myself at all. I'm proud of who it's made me. But being an atheist is lonely, especially in Utah. Even though there are a lot of us out there, it's offensive and unacceptable to so many people. You really have to get to the point where you can come out of the closet and forget what anyone else thinks. You have to be willing to say -- at least in your head -- "fuck off" to someone who doesn't really want you to be yourself. People ought to root for others to be themselves; forget those who don't. Something as simple as openly being yourself is very empowering, and it's taken for granted by everyone in many ways.
Anyway, I was talking about being alone. Or feeling alone. But there was one statistic in the movie which I found quite encouraging. About 16% of Americans don't want to be affiliated with any religion. According to the CIA via Wikipedia, about 4% are "none" and 12% are "unaffiliated". There are way more of us than Mormons. Way more of us than Jews. Way way more of us than Muslims. More of us than there are gays. How come it seems so unacceptable to be nonreligious?
The movie also goes on to point out how detrimental religion truly is to humanity. Religion has done more harm than good throughout history and continues to today. I'm willing to have that argument with you, but I'm not going to elaborate in this post because giving a single example just doesn't do the magnitude of it justice. There's an endless stream of examples.
Another thing that struck me in the movie is the common argument styles of every religious person Bill talks to. It's something I've seen so many times. I'll try to generalize it here. The pattern goes something like, "I believe [insert something unprovable] because it's true and I know it's true in my heart because of [insert some anecdote here that very thinly implies the point they're trying to make]. Therefore it's true and you just don't understand because you're not one of us." The problem is, in everyday conversation, especially with people you know, you have to just let this mess of asinine logic go unchallenged because it's just that: asinine. To call out the flaws in their argument is tantamount to calling them stupid. But even if you take that risk and point out that they're just believing something silly based purely on faith, they get very defensive. Now you're offending them. Now you're talking about something you're not allowed to talk about. And there's the rub. You cannot reason with these people when you get to this level. It's not an even playing field. You're playing the game by the rules of rationality -- they're playing by a very different set of rules. Now you're talking past each other and it's futile.
At the end, Bill calls on people like me to not give up on this exercise in apparent futility because it's really not all for nothing. The more we can open up people's eyes to the world we live in, the better it is for all of us. People who are certain about their religion are dangerous; especially when they reach positions of power where they apply their beliefs blindly to things as important as public policy. Sound familiar? We cannot let that happpen again.
Anyhow, I've come a long way from hiding my true self. I hope people like me can continue forward with this march and be fairly represented in the country and the world. But at this point, it just feels like we're not part of the dialogue.
My honest dream is to one day be an openly atheist politician, but any time I start that thought experiment I give in to cynicism.
The movie reminded me of how lonely I've been my whole life. I'm not trying to win sympathy points here, I don't feel bad for myself at all. I'm proud of who it's made me. But being an atheist is lonely, especially in Utah. Even though there are a lot of us out there, it's offensive and unacceptable to so many people. You really have to get to the point where you can come out of the closet and forget what anyone else thinks. You have to be willing to say -- at least in your head -- "fuck off" to someone who doesn't really want you to be yourself. People ought to root for others to be themselves; forget those who don't. Something as simple as openly being yourself is very empowering, and it's taken for granted by everyone in many ways.
Anyway, I was talking about being alone. Or feeling alone. But there was one statistic in the movie which I found quite encouraging. About 16% of Americans don't want to be affiliated with any religion. According to the CIA via Wikipedia, about 4% are "none" and 12% are "unaffiliated". There are way more of us than Mormons. Way more of us than Jews. Way way more of us than Muslims. More of us than there are gays. How come it seems so unacceptable to be nonreligious?
The movie also goes on to point out how detrimental religion truly is to humanity. Religion has done more harm than good throughout history and continues to today. I'm willing to have that argument with you, but I'm not going to elaborate in this post because giving a single example just doesn't do the magnitude of it justice. There's an endless stream of examples.
Another thing that struck me in the movie is the common argument styles of every religious person Bill talks to. It's something I've seen so many times. I'll try to generalize it here. The pattern goes something like, "I believe [insert something unprovable] because it's true and I know it's true in my heart because of [insert some anecdote here that very thinly implies the point they're trying to make]. Therefore it's true and you just don't understand because you're not one of us." The problem is, in everyday conversation, especially with people you know, you have to just let this mess of asinine logic go unchallenged because it's just that: asinine. To call out the flaws in their argument is tantamount to calling them stupid. But even if you take that risk and point out that they're just believing something silly based purely on faith, they get very defensive. Now you're offending them. Now you're talking about something you're not allowed to talk about. And there's the rub. You cannot reason with these people when you get to this level. It's not an even playing field. You're playing the game by the rules of rationality -- they're playing by a very different set of rules. Now you're talking past each other and it's futile.
At the end, Bill calls on people like me to not give up on this exercise in apparent futility because it's really not all for nothing. The more we can open up people's eyes to the world we live in, the better it is for all of us. People who are certain about their religion are dangerous; especially when they reach positions of power where they apply their beliefs blindly to things as important as public policy. Sound familiar? We cannot let that happpen again.
Anyhow, I've come a long way from hiding my true self. I hope people like me can continue forward with this march and be fairly represented in the country and the world. But at this point, it just feels like we're not part of the dialogue.
My honest dream is to one day be an openly atheist politician, but any time I start that thought experiment I give in to cynicism.
8 comments:
As an openly religious person, I am probably not exactly the type you would want to comment on this post...
I don't want to get into the discussion of what is "right and wrong" about belief/lack of belief in a specific religion.
Having lived in Utah most of my life, I understand and have seen that there are many things about its culture (dominated by mormonism) that are closed-minded and judgmental.
I can never "convince" you of what I believe, just as you can't "convince" me about your lack of belief on God.
The thing I think is important is that we create an open, honest dialogue. I think you are right that people get defensive when religion comes in the discussion... Especially criticisms.
I think part of being human is discovering how you fit in this world. For some religion provides adequate answers; for others it doesn't. It is up to an individual to decide what he or she wants to believe, and others should accept your decision.
Although I haven't seen Maher's movie, I think the main source of violence and conflict that he references regarding religion is related to lack of communication and acceptance of others' viewpoints. One major aspect of religion is to help a person live a peaceful, good life. However all too often, people of religious persuasion, result to non-religious (ie non-peaceful) methods to assert their beliefs on others. I believe this is where the true essence of religion and its practice part ways. Moreover, I have met plenty of non-religious people who are more generous, kind and compassionate than I am.
Agree to disagree... I think that is the key to promoting a peaceful existence.
Thank you for your post. It made me take a step back and evaluate how I interact with people regardless of belief system.
Love your posts . . . and, as you know, I love you no matter what you believe or don't believe. As I have often told you, my religion is love without condition, and to keep fear out of the equation. The true measure of a person's beliefs is whether it derives from love or from fear. And it is more important to examine what's in your own heart, than what is in the heart of another.
Love always,
Your Mom
Wow...this post was a little difficult for me to read. It wouldn't be if I hadn't lost my mom. My precious, loving, angelic mom. And here I am, sitting here and can't stop the tears from coming. (having an emotional day anyway) I feel like I can't survive this life without her, there's just no way. But if I didn't believe I would see her again, that there was a greater purpose I would have left this world right along with her the day she did, that horrible awful day that I cannot erase from my mind. But I know I have to see her again...that person who gave me life...who loved me...my best friend. I know she still exists because I have felt her, and I know she wouldn't leave me all alone without her in this horrible place. Without religion I would not be here living right now I promise you that. I miss her. Sorry, I probably have no right to leave a comment. Just feeling especially sad and vulnerable at the moment. Faith is the only thing getting me through this...and even with that I'm not doing well. Love you to death Greg always will. I think you are one of the sweetest people I have ever met and always will. Thanks for your comments on my blog. -Shannon-
Hey Greg
I remember when we used to have conversations about this. I am sure that those conversations made me a more complete person too.
Just a few thoughts...
I feel lonely often too. I'm sure being an atheist in Utah is difficult, but you're not alone in feeling lonely. Try being an active Mormon who has constant conflict in his mind between compelling, rational arguments against the existence of God and good feelings associated with his admittedly irrational belief system (that's me). I think I have the heart of a Mormon and the mind of an agnostic. I don't even have any of those mystical stories that you mentioned to back up my beliefs.
It's only been in the last few years that I've realized that if there is a God, he gave me this mind that doubts that he exists sometimes, and that he doesn't want me to close it off to science and philosophy or any other triumph of human thinking.
I feel like I can relate to you more than to many people in my own faith because we don't pass judgment on each other and don't try to convince each other. (I'm not a good convincer anyway.)
Bill Maher alienates me quite a bit because I have never seen him interview anyone that represents religious thought well. I've only seen ignorant people on his show. (Haven't watched "Religulous".) Then he uses them to represent people like me who go to church but who are just as frustrated with those people as he is.
Anyway, I think it's important to distinguish between:
*fanatics/fundamentalists
*ignorant but peaceful people
*people who want to legislate their belief system onto others
*religious philanthropists
*people who go to church but don't believe
*people who believe but don't go to church
*people who sometimes believe
I could go on, but I don't think you can say "religion" and have it convey all these nuances.
Sorry for the long post. And good to find your blog!
nice post,
thought you might find this posting amusing.
i've had lots of 'discussions' with creationists and i just can't do it anymore. if a person chooses to turn of logic (i.e their brain) in a discussion, then there's no hope.
Interesting stats, I would have never guessed.
You don't need to doubt your ability to be an openly atheist politician - check out my congressman Pete Stark: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pete_Stark he's openly atheist, very popular, and has been in office since the 70s!
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